Who Sits on the THRONE in Revelation Chapter 4 and 5

1

101G

Well-known member
Scripture, Revelation 4:1 "After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter."

Revelation 4:2 "And immediately I was in the spirit: and, behold, a throne was set in heaven, and one sat on the throne."

Revelation 4:3 "And he that sat was to look upon like a jasper and a sardine stone: and there was a rainbow round about the throne, in sight like unto an emerald."

the Book of Revelation is very very clear, that only ... "ONE" person sits on the throne in heaven.
My Point here is to reveal, that God, (IS A SINGLE PERSON), who is in a ECHAD, that is the NUMERICALLY DIFFERENT in the EQUAL SHARE of himself as "Ordinal First/Father", TITLE, LORD, (CREATOR, and MAKER), of all things. and he is ... "ALSO" the "Ordinal; Last/Son", TITLE Lord, (REDEEMER and SAVIOUR), of all that he created & Made.

this Topic will put to rest any TRINITY (three persons). claims, and any Jewish and ONENESS, ONLY, Claims ALSO. and any other religion and their doctrine that claims any Godhead doctrine that suppose correct. EVERYTHING IS ON THE LINE. I take the stand of the prophet Elijah, 1 Kings 18:21 "And Elijah came unto all the people, and said, How long halt ye between two opinions? if the LORD be God, follow him: but if Baal, then follow him. And the people answered him not a word."

This is now my stand in the Lord Jesus ... today.... How Long halt ye between two opinions?

I asked a simple question, "WHO is he that sits on the THRONE. and i have received many throw off answers...... ie .., Oh it's God the Father, or simply it's GOD, using "God" in a General term in an effort to cover their tracks. well none of those answer are correct, and here's why.

for all who use those replies, you have a GREAT DILEMMA, because he, he, he, the ONE PERSON who sits on the throne was GIVEN POWER, Listen, Revelation 4:11 "Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created."

see the problem, he that sits, receive POWER, and yet he was the ONE who CREATED ALL THINGS. so if ONE say it was the Father, or if one say it's just "GOD", my question to you is this, ... "WHO GAVE THE FATHER, OR JUST "GOD" ... POWER?' do one now see their DILEMMA? for if it was the Father who gave the Father Power, and if it's God who GAVE "GOD" power?.

now I have scripture where he, who sits, is GIVEN POWER, the ONE PERSON, who CREATED, and MADE ALL THINGS, scripture,

Matthew 28:18 "And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth."

Now the question, WHO GAVE "ALL POWER" unto the Lord JESUS... this is the QUESTION, remember he created and Made all things...... are we getting it now.
well the bible has that answer.

so we ask, "HOW LONG ARE YOU GOING TO LIMP ALONG". if the LORD be God, follow him: but if Baal, then follow him, so what's your answer? in the Name of the Lord Jesus/Yeshua, I'm calling out all .... be ye Jewish, Christian, Muslim, or whatever you believe, in the Lord Jesus/Yeshua, 101G invite you to DINNER. and yes, this is also revealed in the OT, the Tanakh. so there is no excuses anymore.

2 Timothy 2:15 "Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth."

PICJAG, 101G.
 
Well, 101G will give the Bible answer, as to who sits on the THRONE, it is the Lord JESUS/YESHUA. and yes, he is the "First" and the "Last" for in Revelation chapter 5 he sit as well as he stand as the LAMB, (YES, ONE PERSON). note: as the OFFSPRING of David he sits, and as the ROOT of David he stands, Oh my, my, my.

is not the bible GRAND? it gives us all the answer to all the Godhead questions.

so, in the Lord Jesus/Yeshua, we say it is he, the Lord who sits ........ per Psalms 110:1 and Isaiah 9:6 ..... oh this is too easy.

PICJAG, 101G.
 
as my motto states, "Where there is KNOWLEDGE, Stay not Ignorant". lets get learned. to understand the ONE God who DIED, and Rose, and who Sits, and Stand at the same time. one must go back to the BEGINNING.
Genesis 1:1 "In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.". this term beginning set the stage for our learning as to WHAT God is.
Beginning: H7225 רֵאשִׁית re'shiyth (ray-sheeth') n-f.
1. the first, in place, time, order or rank.
2. (specifically) a firstfruit.
[from the same as H7218]
KJV: beginning, chief(-est), first(-fruits, part, time), principal thing.
Root(s): H7218

definition #1. says it all as to "WHAT" God is. he is the "FIRST" in place, time, order or rank. and to be this, "FIRST" in place, time, order, or rank, this term "God" H430 אֱלֹהִים 'elohiym (el-o-heem'), itself is a plural. but a plural of what or "WHO?" answer, The plural of H433. Note I said, "THE", and not "a" plural of H433. so who is H433, answer,

H433 אֱלוֹהַּ 'elowahh (el-o'-ah) n-m.
אֱלֹהַּ 'eloahh (el-o'-ah) [shortened (rarely)]
1. one with supreme strength and ability.
2. the Supreme Being, God the Creator, Yahweh by name.
3. a supreme entity, a god-like creature (that is, one of God's supreme creations, or one of man's inventions).
[probably prolonged (emphat.) from H410]
KJV: God, god.
Root(s): H410

Understand, "God" H430 אֱלֹהִים 'elohiym (el-o-heem') is the ECHAD, (a plurality), of H433 אֱלוֹהַּ 'elowahh (el-o'-ah) who is the yachid, (ONE PERSON SINGULAR).

so the question is this, "How can God be a plurality of a "ONE" single Person". answer in an EQUAL "SHARE" of himself in flesh that was to come.

this is the difference between an "ECHAD" of ONE vs an "yachid" of One. .... "SHARING". which correct the trinity doctrine of three separate and distinct person, and the Oneness doctrine of only one Person. which we will see into this discussion further. we will catch all the false claims and correct all the lack of knowledge in the scriptures by the written word.

so to know the GODHEAD, one must KNOW the ECHAD of God, in place, time, order or rank.
and the first place to start is Deuteronomy 6:4 "Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD:" which confirm our God, the H430 אֱלֹהִים 'elohiym (el-o-heem'), in the ECHAD as "LORD", the Ordinal "FIRST"/Father, CREATOR & MAKER of ALL THINGS. and our God, the H430 אֱלֹהִים 'elohiym (el-o-heem'), in the ECHAD as "Lord", the Ordinal "LAST"/Son, REDEEMER & SAVIOUR of ALL THINGS.
all of this is right in our bible ... waiting to be read, understood, and LEARNED.

when one understand the ECHAD in it;s simplist form, (the SHARING of oneself, EQUALLY), then one will understand how God can sit and stand at the same as in Reve Chapter 5. Oh this is going to get ... GoooooD.

PICJAG, 101G.
 
101G said:
Scripture, Revelation 4:1 "After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter."

Revelation 4:2 "And immediately I was in the spirit: and, behold, a throne was set in heaven, and one sat on the throne."

Revelation 4:3 "And he that sat was to look upon like a jasper and a sardine stone: and there was a rainbow round about the throne, in sight like unto an emerald."

the Book of Revelation is very very clear, that only ... "ONE" person sits on the throne in heaven.
My Point here is to reveal, that God, (IS A SINGLE PERSON), who is in a ECHAD, that is the NUMERICALLY DIFFERENT in the EQUAL SHARE of himself as "Ordinal First/Father", TITLE, LORD, (CREATOR, and MAKER), of all things. and he is ... "ALSO" the "Ordinal; Last/Son", TITLE Lord, (REDEEMER and SAVIOUR), of all that he created & Made.

this Topic will put to rest any TRINITY (three persons). claims, and any Jewish and ONENESS, ONLY, Claims ALSO. and any other religion and their doctrine that claims any Godhead doctrine that suppose correct. EVERYTHING IS ON THE LINE. I take the stand of the prophet Elijah, 1 Kings 18:21 "And Elijah came unto all the people, and said, How long halt ye between two opinions? if the LORD be God, follow him: but if Baal, then follow him. And the people answered him not a word."

This is now my stand in the Lord Jesus ... today.... How Long halt ye between two opinions?

I asked a simple question, "WHO is he that sits on the THRONE. and i have received many throw off answers...... ie .., Oh it's God the Father, or simply it's GOD, using "God" in a General term in an effort to cover their tracks. well none of those answer are correct, and here's why.

for all who use those replies, you have a GREAT DILEMMA, because he, he, he, the ONE PERSON who sits on the throne was GIVEN POWER, Listen, Revelation 4:11 "Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created."

see the problem, he that sits, receive POWER, and yet he was the ONE who CREATED ALL THINGS. so if ONE say it was the Father, or if one say it's just "GOD", my question to you is this, ... "WHO GAVE THE FATHER, OR JUST "GOD" ... POWER?' do one now see their DILEMMA? for if it was the Father who gave the Father Power, and if it's God who GAVE "GOD" power?.

now I have scripture where he, who sits, is GIVEN POWER, the ONE PERSON, who CREATED, and MADE ALL THINGS, scripture,

Matthew 28:18 "And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth."

Now the question, WHO GAVE "ALL POWER" unto the Lord JESUS... this is the QUESTION, remember he created and Made all things...... are we getting it now.
well the bible has that answer.

so we ask, "HOW LONG ARE YOU GOING TO LIMP ALONG". if the LORD be God, follow him: but if Baal, then follow him, so what's your answer? in the Name of the Lord Jesus/Yeshua, I'm calling out all .... be ye Jewish, Christian, Muslim, or whatever you believe, in the Lord Jesus/Yeshua, 101G invite you to DINNER. and yes, this is also revealed in the OT, the Tanakh. so there is no excuses anymore.

2 Timothy 2:15 "Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth."

PICJAG, 101G.
Click to expand...
The Lord God sits on the throne.
 
Revelation 5:13
To Him who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb, be blessing and honor and glory and dominion forever and ever

Revelation 7:10
and they cry out with a loud voice, saying, “Salvation to our God who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb.”


Jesus is not the Father.
 
Fred said:
Revelation 5:13
To Him who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb, be blessing and honor and glory and dominion forever and ever

Revelation 7:10
and they cry out with a loud voice, saying, “Salvation to our God who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb.”


Jesus is not the Father.
Click to expand...
ok, if Jesus is not the Father who sits on the throne?
PICJAG, 101G.
 
101G said:
ok, if Jesus is not the Father who sits on the throne?
PICJAG, 101G.
Click to expand...

They both do.


Revelation 6:16-17
(16) and they said to the mountains and to the rocks, “Fall on us and hide us from the presence of Him who sits on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb;
(17) for the great day of their wrath has come, and who is able to stand?" (NASB)

From the presence of Him (Person #1)
and
From the wrath of the Lamb (Person #2)

Notice also in verse 17 the plural pronoun "their" is used as well.
 
Fred said:
They both do.
Click to expand...
First ERROR of the Day for you Fred, did you not read only "ONE" sit. so both is not bible. try again.
Fred said:
Revelation 6:16-17
(16) and they said to the mountains and to the rocks, “Fall on us and hide us from the presence of Him who sits on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb;
(17) for the great day of their wrath has come, and who is able to stand? (NASB)

From the presence of Him (Person #1)
and
From the wrath of the Lamb (Person #2)

Notice also in verse 17 the plural pronoun "their" is used as well.
Click to expand...
Your second ERROR of the DAY, listen, Revelation 5:6 "And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth."

slain? only the Lord Jesus was slain, and now resurrected, (standing), so try again.
PICJAG, 101G.
 
101G said:
Scripture, Revelation 4:1 "After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter."

Revelation 4:2 "And immediately I was in the spirit: and, behold, a throne was set in heaven, and one sat on the throne."

Revelation 4:3 "And he that sat was to look upon like a jasper and a sardine stone: and there was a rainbow round about the throne, in sight like unto an emerald."

the Book of Revelation is very very clear, that only ... "ONE" person sits on the throne in heaven.
My Point here is to reveal, that God, (IS A SINGLE PERSON), who is in a ECHAD, that is the NUMERICALLY DIFFERENT in the EQUAL SHARE of himself as "Ordinal First/Father", TITLE, LORD, (CREATOR, and MAKER), of all things. and he is ... "ALSO" the "Ordinal; Last/Son", TITLE Lord, (REDEEMER and SAVIOUR), of all that he created & Made.

this Topic will put to rest any TRINITY (three persons). claims, and any Jewish and ONENESS, ONLY, Claims ALSO. and any other religion and their doctrine that claims any Godhead doctrine that suppose correct. EVERYTHING IS ON THE LINE. I take the stand of the prophet Elijah, 1 Kings 18:21 "And Elijah came unto all the people, and said, How long halt ye between two opinions? if the LORD be God, follow him: but if Baal, then follow him. And the people answered him not a word."

This is now my stand in the Lord Jesus ... today.... How Long halt ye between two opinions?

I asked a simple question, "WHO is he that sits on the THRONE. and i have received many throw off answers...... ie .., Oh it's God the Father, or simply it's GOD, using "God" in a General term in an effort to cover their tracks. well none of those answer are correct, and here's why.

for all who use those replies, you have a GREAT DILEMMA, because he, he, he, the ONE PERSON who sits on the throne was GIVEN POWER, Listen, Revelation 4:11 "Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created."

see the problem, he that sits, receive POWER, and yet he was the ONE who CREATED ALL THINGS. so if ONE say it was the Father, or if one say it's just "GOD", my question to you is this, ... "WHO GAVE THE FATHER, OR JUST "GOD" ... POWER?' do one now see their DILEMMA? for if it was the Father who gave the Father Power, and if it's God who GAVE "GOD" power?.

now I have scripture where he, who sits, is GIVEN POWER, the ONE PERSON, who CREATED, and MADE ALL THINGS, scripture,

Matthew 28:18 "And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth."

Now the question, WHO GAVE "ALL POWER" unto the Lord JESUS... this is the QUESTION, remember he created and Made all things...... are we getting it now.
well the bible has that answer.

so we ask, "HOW LONG ARE YOU GOING TO LIMP ALONG". if the LORD be God, follow him: but if Baal, then follow him, so what's your answer? in the Name of the Lord Jesus/Yeshua, I'm calling out all .... be ye Jewish, Christian, Muslim, or whatever you believe, in the Lord Jesus/Yeshua, 101G invite you to DINNER. and yes, this is also revealed in the OT, the Tanakh. so there is no excuses anymore.

2 Timothy 2:15 "Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth."

PICJAG, 101G.
Click to expand...
It was God and not Jesus and if you read the context carefully and are honest about it, you will see this, because it is stated that the one who was sitting on the throne hands the scroll to the lamb who is standing in the midst of the throne with the four living creatures and 24 elders.

Read it again, for this is made very clear in the passage in both chapter 4 and 5 also.
 
101G said:
First ERROR of the Day for you Fred, did you not read only "ONE" sit. so both is not bible. try again.

Your second ERROR of the DAY, listen, Revelation 5:6 "And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth."

slain? only the Lord Jesus was slain, and now resurrected, (standing), so try again.
PICJAG, 101G.
Click to expand...

You are dodging the use of "their" in Revelation 6:17 because it refutes your heresy.

Try again.
 
Yahweh will increase said:
It was God and not Jesus and if you read the context carefully and are honest about it, you will see this, because it is stated that the one who was sitting on the throne hands the scroll to the lamb who is standing in the midst of the throne with the four living creatures and 24 elders.

Read it again, for this is made very clear in the passage in both chapter 4 and 5 also.
Click to expand...
see above reply to Fred, understand, he who sits is he who stands.... (smile)... oh this is too easy.
PICJAG, 101G.
 
101G said:
Well, 101G will give the Bible answer, as to who sits on the THRONE, it is the Lord JESUS/YESHUA. and yes, he is the "First" and the "Last" for in Revelation chapter 5 he sit as well as he stand as the LAMB, (YES, ONE PERSON). note: as the OFFSPRING of David he sits, and as the ROOT of David he stands, Oh my, my, my.

is not the bible GRAND? it gives us all the answer to all the Godhead questions.

so, in the Lord Jesus/Yeshua, we say it is he, the Lord who sits ........ per Psalms 110:1 and Isaiah 9:6 ..... oh this is too easy.

PICJAG, 101G.
Click to expand...
Totally wrong, for it is stated right in that very context that the one who is sitting on the throne hands the scroll to the lamb (Jesus) who is standing in the midst of the throne and not sitting on the throne.

This just proves your ignorance and your lack of understanding how to receive from the Holy Spirit when reading and examining the scriptures and that goes for you also CB, being you gave him a thumbs up on this.
 
Fred said:
You are dodging the use of "their" in Revelation 6:17 because it refutes your heresy.

Try again.
Click to expand...
once more, he who sits is he who stands, listen and weep, Revelation 5:2 "And I saw a strong angel proclaiming with a loud voice, Who is worthy to open the book, and to loose the seals thereof?"

Revelation 5:3 "And no man in heaven, nor in earth, neither under the earth, was able to open the book, neither to look thereon."

Revelation 5:4 "And I wept much, because no man was found worthy to open and to read the book, neither to look thereon."

Revelation 5:5 "And one of the elders saith unto me, Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Juda, the Root of David, hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof."

the Lion of Judah is who? yes, the Lord Jesus, who is the LAMB. my God how hard is it to understand. now Fred is the Lord Jesus the thew Lamb who stands? yes or No.

PICJAG, 101G.
 
101G said:
once more, he who sits is he who stands, listen and weep, Revelation 5:2 "And I saw a strong angel proclaiming with a loud voice, Who is worthy to open the book, and to loose the seals thereof?"

Revelation 5:3 "And no man in heaven, nor in earth, neither under the earth, was able to open the book, neither to look thereon."

Revelation 5:4 "And I wept much, because no man was found worthy to open and to read the book, neither to look thereon."

Revelation 5:5 "And one of the elders saith unto me, Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Juda, the Root of David, hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof."

the Lion of Judah is who? yes, the Lord Jesus, who is the LAMB. my God how hard is it to understand. now Fred is the Lord Jesus the thew Lamb who stands? yes or No.

PICJAG, 101G.
Click to expand...
LOL, of course the lion of Judah is Jesus and is the one who was worthy to open the scroll but he wasn't sitting on the throne but standing in the midst of the throne and the one who was sitting on the throne and which is God, he handed the scroll to Jesus the lamb and Lion of Judah who was standing in the midst of the throne with four living creatures and 24 elders.

Sorry but you are only proving your ignorance here, for you are totally wrong.


So you can attempt to save face in your obvious pride and argue about it all you want but what it says it says and it proves you wrong period.
 
Yahweh will increase said:
Totally wrong, for it is stated right in that very context that the one who is sitting on the throne hands the scroll to the lamb (Jesus) who is standing in the midst of the throne and not sitting on the throne.

This just proves your ignorance and your lack of understanding how to receive from the Holy Spirit when reading and examining the scriptures and that goes for you also CB, being you gave him a thumbs up on this.
Click to expand...
LOL, LOL, LOL, how carnal can one be, "the one who is sitting on the throne hands the scroll to the lamb (Jesus) who is standing in the midst of the throne and not sitting on the throne."
Ok, lets see if what you say is true, scripture, Revelation 1:1 "The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:"
so, Yahweh will increase, who was it that sent his angel to John? now before you answer, listen to who the angel say sent him, listen, Revelation 22:6 "And he said unto me, These sayings are faithful and true: and the Lord God of the holy prophets sent his angel to shew unto his servants the things which must shortly be done." remember you said one gave the scrool to the other... and the angel said it was the Lord God... of the Holy Prophets that sent him, so who is the Lord God by name who sent the angel? your answer please, and it will clear up the matter.

PICJAG, 101G.
 
Yahweh will increase said:
LOL, of course the lion of Judah is Jesus and is the one who was worthy to open the scroll but he wasn't sitting on the throne but standing in the midst of the throne and the one who was sitting on the throne and which is God, he handed the scroll to Jesus the lamb and Lion of Judah who was standing in the midst of the throne with four living creatures and 24 elders.

Sorry but you are only proving your ignorance here, for you are totally wrong.


So you can attempt to save face in your obvious pride and argue about it all you want but what it says it says and it proves you wrong period.
Click to expand...
see post #17 which will answer all the questions.
]PICJAG, 101G
 
Yahweh will increase said:
LOL, of course the lion of Judah is Jesus and is the one who was worthy to open the scroll but he wasn't sitting on the throne but standing in the midst of the throne and the one who was sitting on the throne and which is God, he handed the scroll to Jesus the lamb and Lion of Judah who was standing in the midst of the throne with four living creatures and 24 elders.
Click to expand...
ok, if it was "GOD" sitting on the throne, my question to you, "WHO GAVEGOD POWER?' listen and weep, Revelation 4:11 "Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created."

now give me BOOK , CHAPTER, and VERSE, as to WHO gave "GOD" POWER... your answer please.
]
]PICJAG, 101G.
 
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